God's Name « Thread Started on Feb 27, 2006, 6:20pm »
Sometimes JW's make it sound like they are the ones who invented the name Jehovah.
I have no problem with the name and I'm more than comfortable with it being inserted in the English translations rather than the substitute LORD, but do JW's realize where it came from?
I said "invented" because it actually was an invention of one Galatinus in 1520 when he combined the vowel points of Lord [adonai] with the consonants JHVH [YHWH]. I would even go so far as to believe it conceivable that God could have been using that fellow to restore his name.
It's just that JW's seem to think they have a monopoly on the name Jehovah, and that just isn't so. It was around hundreds of years before they decided to declare the frequency of its use as a defining characteristic of the only religion God is happy with. #wink#
Are they still playing that boredom-chasing game of counting how many times it's used in the talks?
It's of some interest that this was NOT considered a basic truth in 1914 when Jehovah is supposed to have chosen them as the FDS; and they used the KJV of the Bible [4 places where Jehovah is used] instead of the ASV which had it throughout the OT at least. So when did they change their view on the efficacy of its repeated use?
Re: God's Name « Reply #2 on Feb 28, 2006, 7:30pm »
#smile# Others have been using God's name Jehovah for centuries before the JW's finally discovered it. #blink# It's good that you finally got in step with other Christians!
And while we recognize that God has a personal name, and Jehovah is probably the closest we can get to it in English, the name above every name, the name at which every knee will bow, the only name given by which we are saved, is NOT Jehovah.
Re: God's Name « Reply #4 on Mar 1, 2006, 6:22pm »
If I might, allow me to share a quote from a man who served as one of God's anointed on the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses:
Quote:
One might think, from reading the Watch Tower publications, that the name "Jehovah" was virtually unknown before its appearance in those publications, and that these have brought it to the world's notice. An examination of the Watch Tower publications during the first forty years of their existence, however, reveals that the name "Jehovah" appeared with no greater frequency in those publications than in many other religious publications of the times. As just one example, the Watch Tower isuue of April 15, 1919, contained the name "Jehovah" only one time in the entire magazine! That would be unthinkable today. Yet by 1919 Christ Jesus is supposed to have already approved and chosen, out of all the religions on earth, the organization built around the Watch Tower Society as his sole channel of communication. If so, one would be obliged to say that his choice evidently was not predicated on any special prominence given to the name "Jehovah."p.492 In Search of Christian Freedom, Raymond Franz
Re: God's Name « Reply #5 on Mar 2, 2006, 6:39am »
In truth, English language bibles used to print the name "Jehovah" on a regular basis a long time ago, long before the New World Translation became published. The Darby Bible came out in the late 1800's and used the Divine Name all throughout the Old Testament. The American Standard Version does the same, as does Young's Literal Translation. I'm sure there's others, those are just the ones I know off the top of my head.
So, I wouldn't say the Jehovah's Witnesses are unique in that they use God's name....I would say it's more like they are unique in that they have God's name in their group's name. I mean, you never hear of a group called "Yahweh's Catholics", or "Jehovah's Baptists". Jehovah's Witnesses are the only major Christian group that actually has God's name as a part of their title. That alone would cause an association in one's mind between the Name and the group, making it seem like the group is the foremost promoter of the Divine Name. Every time you speak of them you say the Divine Name, every time you pass a Kingdom Hall you will see the Name on the sign, whenever you receive a Watchtower magazine there is the Name on the front cover. It's actually a great idea: Embed the Divine Name into the group name and voila, you automatically promote the Name just by existing!
Of course, other denominations also use the Divine Name, I've heard them myself on television, radio, and even in songs. However, Jehovah's Witnesses are more known for it because you can't speak about them without saying the Name. You can speak about Methodists, Lutherans, Adventists, and even Mormons without once saying the word "Jehovah"....but you cannot do the same when speaking of the Jehovah's Witnesses.
Oh goodness...here I go rambling on again...sorry! Not sure where I was going with all this, but I just wanted to share. #mushy#
Re: God's Name « Reply #7 on Mar 2, 2006, 10:26am »
Hi Tami,
I wonder, though, if this repetitive use of Jehovah is what is meant by hallowing and honoring God's name? If so, then that's what we'd expect from Jesus and the NT writers, correct? Yet that wasn't the case for them.
Jesus' followers are called simply Christians, showing God's purpose is that we follow his Christ, his Anointed One.
Re: God's Name « Reply #8 on Mar 3, 2006, 6:21am »
Quote:
Hi Tami,
I wonder, though, if this repetitive use of Jehovah is what is meant by hallowing and honoring God's name? If so, then that's what we'd expect from Jesus and the NT writers, correct? Yet that wasn't the case for them.
Jesus' followers are called simply Christians, showing God's purpose is that we follow his Christ, his Anointed One.
Love, Libby
Hello Libby,we teach that ,The name is a form of a Hebrew verb ha·wah' (), meaning "to become," and actually signifies "He Causes to Become." * Thus, God's name identifies him as the One who progressively fulfills his promises and unfailingly realizes his purposes. Only the true God could bear such a meaningful name.
While many translators favor the pronunciation Yahweh, the New World Translation and also a number of other translations continue the use of the form Jehovah because of people's familiarity with it for centuries. Moreover, it preserves, equally with other forms, the four letters of the Tetragrammaton, YHWH or JHVH.#
Earlier, the German professor Gustav Friedrich Oehler made a similar decision for much the same reason. He discussed various pronunciations and concluded: "From this point onward I use the word Jehovah, because, as a matter of fact, this name has now become more naturalized in our vocabulary, and cannot be supplanted."—Theologie des Alten Testaments (Theology of the Old Testament), second edition, published in 1882, page 143.
Similarly, in his Grammaire de l'hébreu biblique (Grammar of Biblical Hebrew), 1923 edition, in a footnote on page 49, Jesuit scholar Paul Joüon states: "In our translations, instead of the (hypothetical) form Yahweh, we have used the form Jéhovah . . . which is the conventional literary form used in French." Is it, then, wrong to use a form like Yahweh? Not at all. It is just that the form Jehovah is likely to meet with a quicker response from the reader because it is the form that has been "naturalized" into most languages. The important thing is that we use the name and declare it to others. "Give thanks to Jehovah, you people! Call upon his name. Make known among the peoples his dealings. Make mention that his name is put on high."—Isaiah 12:4.
The Divine Name That Will Endure Forever Published in 1984
Re: God's Name « Reply #9 on Mar 3, 2006, 5:48pm »
The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia bears that out by subscribing "I will be who/what I will be" rather than the traditional "I am that I am" because of the fuller sense of the verb to be; haya, as it says: it "has a more dynamic sense of being---not pure existence, but becoming, happening, being present---and because the historical and theological context of these early chapters of Exodus shows that God is revealing to Moses, and subsequently to the whole people, not the inner nature of His being [or existence], but His active, redemptive intentions on their behalf. He 'will be' to them 'what' His deeds will show Him 'to be'."
It's easy to see, then, the truth of 2 Cor. 1:20 "For no matter how many promises God has made, they are 'Yes' in Christ. And so through him the 'Amen' is spoken by us to the glory of God."
All Jehovah's purposes for mankind are fulfilled in Christ Jesus as he is the one on whom we focus and he is the one the prophecies point to, the promised Messiah, the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world.
Re: God's Name « Reply #10 on Mar 4, 2006, 5:12am »
All Jehovah's purposes for mankind are fulfilled in Christ Jesus as he is the one on whom we focus and he is the one the prophecies point to, the promised Messiah, the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world.
Love, Libby
True and we should be thankful to Jehovah for such loving provision as it is stated in John 3:16.
Joined: Jul 2006 Gender: Male Posts: 99 Location: Hampshire, UK
Re: God's Name « Reply #11 on Jul 23, 2006, 7:40am »
Quote:
All Jehovah's purposes for mankind are fulfilled in Christ Jesus as he is the one on whom we focus and he is the one the prophecies point to, the promised Messiah, the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world.
Love, Libby
True and we should be thankful to Jehovah for such loving provision as it is stated in John 3:16.
I just love this thread! Libby has already very adequately demonstrated that the name Jehovah was unknown prior to the early 16th century. That means that if the apostle Peter suddenly appeared in 2006 and someone used the name Jehovah, he would look at them very blankly. Atalaya has demonstrated that the use of Jehovah is because 'the name has become very naturalized in our language.' Therefore, the name Jehovah is only correct by convention. In the 'Principles of Translation' section of my NASB, I read the following: "THE PROPER NAME OF GOD IN THE OLD TESTAMENT: In the Scriptures, the name of God is most significant and understandably so (garn, there goes the 'conspiracy to remove God's name' theory!). It is inconceivable to think of spiritual matters without a proper designation for the Supreme Deity. Thus the most common name for the Deity is God, a translation of the original Elohim. One of the titles for God is Lord, a translation of Adonai. There is yet another name which is particularly assigned to God as His special or proper name, that is, the four letters YHWH (Exodus 3: 14 and Isaiah 42: 8). This name has not been pronounced by the Jews because of reverence for the great sacredness of the divine name. Therefore, it has been consistently translated LORD. The only exception to to this translation of YHWH is when it occurs in immediate proximity to the word Lord, that is Adonai. In that case it is regularly translated GOD in order to avoid confusion."
So, the use of LORD and GOD is as much by convention as the JW's use of Jehovah!! No-one I have come across has condemned the use of Jehovah by the JW's in the places YHWH occurs in the Hebrew Scriptures, but many JW's have vilified members of the churches when they use LORD or GOD! I now see that this is to raise contention and argument, rather than re-establishing God's true name, so I try and use YHWH in my writings whenever appropriate.
Re: God's Name « Reply #13 on Feb 28, 2007, 6:36pm »
Hello to everyone!
Is there anybody here that can answer for how many generations and years people have used "Hallelujah" Hallelu- Jah in their songs?
Christian love to all of you.
Talkactive.
Ps. The Watchtowers hypocrisy in the blood question can be seen and are documented at http://www.ajwrb.org
Ecclesiastes 1:18! For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow. --------------------------------------------------------------------- People can’t hear and carry the truth, because the lies are tickling their ears!
Jeremiah 8:8! How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.
NB. It has to be mentioned that blood as medicine or any other medicine isn't good medicine, since there will always be side effects, opposite the healing Jesus and his disciples afforded, showing what to come, but in the meantime we have to deal with the life itself as sacred and be able to make personal decisions, to sustain the most important for Jehovah and each individual, the life itself in accordance to Galatians 6:5 and not being forced by threats and sanctions into a premature death, by man made doctrines, in opposition to what comes forth in 2 Corinthians 1:24 and 1 Peter 5:3! Like Tully and thousands of others haven’t been able to do:
Re: God's Name « Reply #14 on Mar 28, 2008, 6:27pm »
Quote:
#smile# Others have been using God's name Jehovah for centuries before the JW's finally discovered it. #blink# It's good that you finally got in step with other Christians!
And while we recognize that God has a personal name, and Jehovah is probably the closest we can get to it in English, the name above every name, the name at which every knee will bow, the only name given by which we are saved, is NOT Jehovah.
Love, Libby
That's right -- it's "Jehovah's Salvation" which is what Jesus means. #clap#
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